Moment -of -Death ?... Life Again?
IS THERE Mercy at Life's End???
Welcome to nathans IBOsocial page. Contact me to learn more!
Get Linked from 16,000 + sites with one click.
“ ~ DEATH ~ ~ DYING ~ ~ ” “MERCY AT LIFE’s END???”
{What is Euthanasia? What is a (( DNR)) or DO NOT RESUSCITATE?}
By Rev. Nathan Von Griffin the Street-Preacher
The occurrence of death is facing baby-boomers now at alarming rates.
Large numbers of us are familiar with the loss of a recent loved one.
Any one; even those who are not baby-boomers who are faced
with the loss of a recent loved one may have encountered some very difficult
questions to answer or difficult decisions to make in the process.
And if you are a Christian or member of a Christian faith of any kind;
all of a sudden some moral questions that affect you directly and your
loved one abruptly comes into play near and around the moment-of-death.
The advent of the necessary decisions can arrive abruptly and not be as
simple as putting that loved one to rest in peace.
Especially if you may have some difficulty in letting that loved one go in the first place.
Or if, you are very attached to that person is a special way.
//
I had the distinct honor and privilege to sit in on one of Rev. Dr. Mark Nuckols;
church {Sunday School meeting} of sorts;
where the Church as a whole sort of gets together and discusses the details
of Death and what it means to their Christian Faith or Church body as a whole.
The location is Austin Texas at St. Paul’s Lutheran Church
3501 Red River St and is not to far from the University of Texas at Austin campus.
I am impressed that the Church is having a meetings of this kind.
So I listen patiently and from time to time, get the opportunity to make a
few comments of my own in the discussion as it nears a very interesting stage of development.
The discussion goes to scriptures pertaining to death ;
things like Jesus Christ’s death on the cross then to many of the deaths
of the Apostles and saints, and then further turns the corner to the subject of Euthanasia.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
//
the word Euthanasia is derived from Greek and French according to Websters Dictionary Eu easy + thanasia death *** The act or means of putting to death persons suffering from incurable conditions or deseases.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Products & Services
NATHANS GIFT SHIP
NathanServicesinc.com
==========================================
The discussion includes formal written literature that pertains
to the subject in broad detail from many aspects and interpretations;
{again I am very impressed that this is happening in a Church}
Euthanasia has Theological arguments along with political arguments as well as humanist arguments.
For evidence of early cases of euthanasia in the United States,
see the story of the Black Stork who euthanized infants in Chicago in the early 20th century.
Each argument has its own perspective pertaining to Death
in general and what is now termed “the Right to Death” or :”The Right to Die”.
And each can become just as heated a debate as Abortion
against the Right to Life and Evolution against Creationism
or any other subject that is opposed to or against our basic
Judeo Christian ideology or is just plain fundamentally
against Christ which is anti-Christ.
==========================================
==========================================
Some physicians in America have forsaken the original creed
given to Medical Professionals which remained in line with the
Judeo Christian Ideology of maintaining life at all costs and in all procedures.
Instead today we now hear very casually of Physician-assisted suicide ;
even in the United States of America.
A country whose civilized founding, was established by Christians.
==========================================
==========================================
Euthanasia is supposedly not legal in any state of the union.
But even in places where these practices are illegal, they are being performed.
I was able to enter into the discussion at this point and voice my
first experience with what I thought was Euthanasia as a young minister.
I was new in my faith conversion and ministerial duties.
So when a personal friend of mine had entered a Hospital’s ICU (an Intensive Care Unit) ;
after falling from slipping on some ice one winter evening after church,
giving him serious trauma to his head:
I took on the duty of visiting him as part of a church-sign-up visitation group,
to the sick and shut-in.
Putting on my Priest’s Stole; because, we had now heard ,
matters had began to turn for what appeared to be the worse case scenario.
Upon arriving at the Hospital; I suddenly realized that I was the only Priest entering ICU;
and was alarmed at how, so many other families were urging me to come and pray for their beloved family member also.
{somehow the subject of race didn’t even matter
( I am African American male); the subject of denominational following or creed didn’t matter :
all of these things were immediately irrelevant in ICU; because of the sense of urgency.}
My personal friend; Roy, as it turns out just happened
to be one of the people that I prayed for that did not recover.
Roy was an active member of the Church; who had converted to Christianity from Buddhism.
He was Japanese.
He was a leader in the men’s Prayer-Breakfast and Lunch meetings.
He oft attended the Promise-keepers rallies with other Christian men in the community.
And I was just quite fond of him as personal friend...
==========================================
==========================================
But there were circumstances surrounding his departure that was suddenly
fixed on me personally as a minister and a friend.
The Doctors were looking to me to help make
a decision for what they termed as a {{ DNR }}.
This is a DO NOT RESUSCITATE procedure.
You see; since this was a Christian Hospital;
consultation with a Priest or Minister is included in the protocol
for decisions that will lead to a loved one departing this earth.
A DO NOT RESUSCITATE differs from Euthanasia in that ;
a) The persons cardiovascular system is not breathing on its own;
but is maintained by a machine apparatus of some kind.
b) The persons brain functions or organs are being completely
stimulated by a machines’ electronic apparatus of some kind.
c) That persons bodily functions continue by way of medical devices and apparatus’ only!
and without these digital/electronic medical devices or machine apparatus;
these bodily organs will not function or operate on their own.
d) Turning these machines / devices/ or apparatus’ off;
will more than likely leave that persons body in a state where doctors can medically determine
or specifically classify that they are in-fact dead.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
_________________________________________________________________
****************************************************************************************
When you're in a new relationship; it's said the staying power comes from remembering the gifts that were given early on in the relationship.
If you don't catch her/him now when there off guard you could lose her/him later on. Because there's nothing to remember you by.
****************************************************************************************
ORDER THEM SOME REALLY GREAT MUSIC
__________________________________________________________________________
About
Nathan Services LLC
Austin, United States
View Profile
Business Industry
- Real Estate
- Internet & eBusiness
- Finance
- Business
- Affiliate MarketingBy Joining Nathan Services Inc Network investors are offered opportunities to Buy Trust Deeds secured by Real Estate and Promissory Notes that offer better than CD interest rates. To join just click join on Nathan Services Inc page and create your own profile. //
This is how the Medical professionals described it to me.
My astonishment left me somewhat puzzled; as a young minister, first of all;
I always understood that all was Euthanasia if you turned anything off. Or pulled any plug.
And secondly what about the soul that’s lying there?
What is his/her decision about all this?
And aren’t doctors suppose to (never-stop) ; functionally,
keeping a human body alive indefinitely?
I thought. What ever happened to the Hippocratic oath?
==========================================
==========================================
Simultaneous to these questions , other issues persisted.
You see Roy’s wife’s face is now buried into the pit of my shoulder.
Where there are tears, sweat and mucous pouring inconsolably.
All from her very emotional desperation to make a rightful decision.
She was in-fact desirous to have a Priest present {for a decision};
in comparison to the medical advice given by doctors.
One that doesn’t violate God’s will, or Roy’s; or her own Christian conscience.
The two daughters however are vehemently, opposed to this procedure unconditionally.
His oldest son is undecided; but desperate after making the long distance trips to see his father,
to just finally arrive at a family conclusion in the whole matter.
================================================
I am informed also, that the Health Insurance policy’s face value amount,
is over extended in the middle of all this.
It is already fully depleted; so shortly, other definite financing will be needed,
to maintain costs and medical expenses.
And further the family, already very badly needs the proceeds from any
Life Insurance policy to cover other non-medical expenses
that are on-going and even more, that are soon yet to come.
My friend Roy is the main bread winner of the household.
This felt like an abrupt wall was pushed into my face,
and it just seemed as if I gathered why; all of sudden;
why there were no other Priests in ICU.
Everyday I went in there, it just seemed to appear as if I were the only one.
The subject never ever seemed to be brought up in Church either; or in any
of the Church dogma or pedagogy.
Euthanasia was fairly rare at that day and time and a DNR was merely a little less unknown.
==========================================
==========================================
My consent to allow the procedure; seemed as if it took breath out of my lungs
and became as if I swallowed a heavy weight that just went down to the pit of my stomach.
I stood next to Roy and walked along side him,
the whole way to the new room he was given.
One with no machines; digital meters or oxygen tanks attached to him.
Roy’s son-in-law joined me as we prayed intensely over him that the LORD
would somehow cause him to recover.
His son-in-law began to show signs of desperation, shaking Roy, and calling out his name loudly.
The life-breath, or any semblance of it; seemed to continue only one more hour on its own.
We bowed our heads finally, and covered his face with the sheet;
at what appeared now, to be the very obvious.
================================================
As I walked out into the hallway with my head down
and Priest vestment still on hanging from my neck;
the man who had urged me to pray for his wife the day before came running up the hallway.
His continence lit up with joy; urging me to come immediately and see her again.
She had somehow recovered and he was all excited.
The day I first saw her; they had a bag; that’s right, literally just a bag of some kind,
and it was being used to keep her breathing.
They would squeeze the bag and wait until she exhaled enough air back into it;
so that they could squeeze it again.
And repeated the procedure in ICU,
while her husband frantically urged me to pray for her right then and there.
He said their budget , just didn’t allow for the expense of having all kinds of medical
devices connected to his wife,
and she just didn’t like needles or machines,
and all kinds of drugs put in her system anyway.
I was then able to formally introduce myself; {The woman explained that she could still hear me praying for her even while in a coma-tose state; but just wondered who I was.}
Hello mam "I'm Rev. Nathan Von Griffin; and your husband and I have been praying for you".
==========================================
==========================================
The same day another man who had come for me to pray for his son;
thanked me by bowing and kissing the back of my hand.
I was somewhat puzzled at his brothers remarks when he came close to me to whisper in my ear.
And asked ‘my brother came and got you???!’
‘ Do you know that my brothers’ an Atheist?! ‘
The boy I prayed for was a young man with a wife,
in his early twenties, who had suffered some unknown
un-diagnosed trauma that left him in a coma-tose state.
I remember laying hands on his body, as it was freezing cold and very notice-ably stiff.
I had never touched a human body that cold before ever.
The doctors had disconnected all the machines and electronic devices, from him also.
As I bowed my head to pray, I could see the light coming in
from the door to the room darken as family members began to
close in closer in the doorway, looking on with intense anticipation.
My prayer lasted for nearly a half hour entreating the LORD to please answer.
To please touch and to please recover this young man.
The next day to see him eating the scrambled eggs, from a plate ,
while sitting up in bed was somewhat alarming even for me.
He gave me a thumbs up as I walked in his room ;his mouth was full of food still.
But, he put the fork down on his plate long enough so he could reach forward and shake my hand briefly,
and then quickly continue eating right away.
His demeanor was as if he already recognized me and knew who
I was although we had never formally been introduced.
==========================================
Nathan Services Inc.com Social Networks
PICASA WEB
CLASSIFIEDS
YAHOO
==========================================
MY FRIEND MARTHA
Martha the homeless lady was a different case, and she too did not recover.
Although she asked me to pray for her many times as
I preached sermons to the general public on the streets and at the Salvation Army chapel.
I often encountered brief visits with her on the streets or at the bus-stops.
Martha always wanted me to pray for her.
She was a Native-American Indian woman who believed in
GOD and accepted the LORD JESUS CHRIST as her personal Savior.
She would, for some strange reason, always be wrapped in a cast of some kind around her arm or her leg.
She always bore the marks and bruises on her person which seemed to indicate continual domestic violence in her life.
She never bothered to explain how or why she obtained these injuries,
even when she would be found on crutches.
Some of her kin also came to get me to pray for her in ICU.
Martha was supposedly involved in a domestic violence dispute,
where she was dropped head first to the concrete surface below, from a three story building.
Whether by deliberately malicious intent or by some crazy facetious behavior,
it was uncertain, from what was told me.
Two women who came to get me, to pray for her stood aside,
as their Native American chief and elders of the tribe stepped
up to me, to inform me that they have their own way.
And they would rather use their own methods of prayer and rituals.
The alarms from the metered machines and digital signals began beeping and chirping suddenly,
for I had only just arrived and barely touched Martha’s face in ICU;
when the doctors and nurses suddenly came and checked on the alarms as they sounded off abruptly, and found us all standing there disputing over who should be allowed to pray for her.
We were all asked to leave immediately, as the
room had suddenly became too crowded to begin with.
I did not want to impose or infringe on any Native American Indian
traditions concerning prayer or death,
so I explained to the women that I will leave Martha in their hands.
I was somewhat hurt in my feelings, by the expression made by one of their elders
that my Christian Faith was nothing more than {‘the white-man’s religion’}.
{seeing that I am African American}.
I simply dismissed this fallacy of composition as mere superstition and turned and went my way.
==========================================
==========================================
As a Christian who wants to uphold the Christian faith and the
doctrine of JESUS CHRIST our LORD and Savior.
We are faced with many aspects and opinions of death and what it means.
Revelations 1:18 says
I am he that liveth, and was dead; and , behold, I am alive for-ever more,
Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death
The advocates of a right to die do not view the central issue as a matter of life and death;
it is a matter of autonomy and self-determination.
Other traditions and rituals may also do the same;
especially if they differ from true Christianity or are in fact anti-Christ.
==============================================
Any doctrine or ritual, belief, law, or human being,
that is opposed to Christ or the commandments of Christ is anti-Christ.
===============================================
kjv::1 john 2: 18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that anti-Christ shall come,even now are there many anti-Christs; whereby we know that it is the last time.
=======================================
And that which is anti-Christ is therefore not just one man
or one thing it is many things and many people.
Christ himself defines the power ofdeath to be in his control only.
==================================================
He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches;
He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death. kjv:only!
====================================================
A second death beyond life’s end is indicated here where it is meant to be entirely under the control of Christ.
It is specified by Christ and is not described by or determined by any man-made logic and reasoning.
Reasoning s such as postulates called mod-us-ponens or mod-us-tollens,
nor is it freely given into the carnal control or natural discernment of men.
That includes, Doctors; Lawyers; Priests, Angels,
tribal rituals nor any other being or phenomena.
matt 28:18 and Jesus came and spake unto them, saying,
All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
There is no power in heaven or in earth that is greater than the power of Christ;
and that includes the power over Death.
=============================================
kjv::st john 11: 25 I am the resurrection, and the life ;
he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live.
And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
matt 11:27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father:......
==========================================
==========================================
Disputes from carnal man-made logic and reasoning; or traditional rituals may persist.
But it is certain that Christ is clearly very convinced of his position,
in this matter, and men will somehow have to convince
-->Him <--that he is definitely wrong.
============================================
There are some serious ambiguities that arise however that may complicate sought out rightful answers;
One example is Euthanasia and how it differs from a DNR;
and at what point is one different from the other?
True Christianity rules that Euthanasia is wrong and {pardon the expression}
‘{{‘Dead Wrong!?%*—‘}}’ from every perspective;
Why ?
Because a life is taken away; which constitutes both, killing and murder;
both of which are against the Law of Christ and are therefore classified as anti-Christ.
==============================================
A human life although suffering from pain or disease is still breathing on his or her own;
is still viably alive; so therefore deliberate; well intended actions:
even if hidden, must deliberately be made or enhanced to stop or kill that life.
And those actions; even if well-intended are still immoral.
And therefore they are still a deliberate Violation of the LAW OF CHRIST.
=========================================
kjv::Romans 14:8-9 For whether we live, we live unto the LORD;
and whether we die, we die unto the LORD: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the LORD’s
9) for to this end CHRIST both died and rose, and revived, that he might be LORD both of the dead and living.
=========================================
A DNR or DO NOT RESUSCITATE; on the other hand differs in that a mechanical device,
or electronic instruments and other oxygen generating apparatus’
are continuing to make the human life continue-to-function artificially.
And the human life, or what appears to be human life in the physical sense;
cannot continue without this apparatus.
Why is this ambiguous?
Because one state of life may seem to appear as the other.
There are cases where individuals have testified of being
declared dead and came back to life.
=========================================
RETURN TO LIFE?
There doesn’t seem to be any measurable time increments
or minimal measurable time span specified in law;
deed or medical procedures where this is even considered as a basic given or individual Right,
a human Right or Civil Right, there seems to be no legal protocol for it at this stage.
For a return from the dead?
The electronic apparatus and metered machines used for medical procedures
are unable to measure or detect instances beyond empirical data when this can and does occur.
In Rev. Dr. Nuckols Church meeting here;
there just happened to be a man who was on-the-other-side.
There in the meeting, with his wife present, who came across this very issue.
I was apt to ask his opinion; What would he choose in this predicament?
We all listened carefully and patiently as he sat with his cane and began to speak slowly and deliberately of what things seemed like to him while in a coma-tos state.
-------------------------------------------
‘ I’m pretty sure I died.’ he said
‘I’m very grateful to be alive.’
-------------------------------------------
It almost seemed deafening the silence that could be heard in the room
as he spake briefly with a delicate soft voice.
=============================================
For me astonishment was present, because I was not expecting
this kind of aspect of the meeting or even as part of the discussion in general.
Even though I am a strong believer in Christ Jesus our Lord and his healing powers.
Many denominational differences also exist among strong believing
Christians regarding this subject.
There are some faiths who adhere to the idea of no miracles of any kind in the present-day tense; even though it is no where written in the Holy Bible of any designatedtime-frame when miracles are supposedly to have ended.
Others simply consider miracles and the stories of miracles in the Holy Bible or elsewhere as nothing more than mere fables.
Where there are yet others who vocally and with obstinate deliberation,
{myself included} who, uphold every miracle in the HOLY BIBLE as an absolute:
then, now, and forever!.
Therefore miracles occur in this present day and time also.
No matter what anybody else says! or believes.
========================================
matt 22: 31-32 But as touching the resurrection of the dead,
have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by GOD, saying
I am the GOD of Abraham, and the GOD of Isaac, and the GOD of Jacob?
GOD is not the GOD of the dead, but of the living.
================================================================
HE (Jesus) speaks of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in his present day tense as if they are alive presently and not dead. Therefore, GOD is still there GOD; as if still living!
and not the GOD of the dead but of the living .
This is miraculous not something that is suppose be derived from man-made carnal logic and reasoning. And further no end of life or end of miracles like this ever mentioned.
PHILISOPHICAL DOGMA
Two philosophical postulates called: modus ponens or modus tollens argue that you can logically- reason and conclude all physical matters by inference or deduction from things that are ideally empirical in nature.
For example : IF:: All animals die; then they are dead when they die; correct?:: ans. yes
THEN:: Since: All cows are animals; when they die; THEN; they are dead! Correct?:: ans. yes
THEREFORE:: Since: All men are like animals; then they too are dead when they
die!::Conclusion:: ans. yes
This kind of man-made empirical logic and reasoning; Does not explain how that JESUS CHRIST was empowered by the HOLY GHOST as the SON OF GOD:: died and was buried; but on the third day HE ROSE AGAIN! According to the scriptures; and this is what we Christians firmly believe in as part of our fundamental Creed our Faith and our Salvation.
========================================
Confronted by the inevitable approach of death,
Christians may be confronted with realistic empirical situations
where it is highly improbable that continued medical therapy
may not produce any beneficial results for the patient.
It may even be that these procedures subject the dying
person to further risk, and they may be costly or are experimental in nature.
In such cases, Christians guided by the Spirit in truth,
that we are always to care and never to kill are often faced with difficult decisions.
Mindful of the fact that ‘we {are not to} hurt or harm our neighbor in his body,
but help and support him/her in every physical need.
Family members should not think that they have to make decisions immediately,
even though there may be pressures from medical personnel to do so.
As well as financial circumstances.
It may be helpful for the family to meet with the pastor outside of
the medical facility in order to have a more prayerful, non-clinical setting for deliberation.
When there is doubt about how to proceed, it is advised that we exercise a bias for life.
It is better to err on the side of life than death.
==========================================
note ::that Matt 9-12 says ....They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick.
this coincides with Mark 2:17 and Luke 5:31 --> original kjv::only!
It is ironic that JESUS CHRIST a Healer acknowledged the need for physicians;
in certain cases.
Physicians should at least acknowledge the divine providence of healing as a miracle when their medical procedures have reached it's limits!
==========================================
I am happy that I was able to be there for my friend Roy as a Priest and a pastoral friend to the family who needed counsel in the middle of a serious family crisis.
In consulting with other Priest and Pastors, I have found that we are very much in agreement on the decision that I made concerning the DO NOT RESUSCITATE procedure.
And that most Clergy who understand quite well what it actually is, and the ambiguity surrounding it; agree. This was when a DNR was fairly new and not commonly heard of; or fully understood.
Rev. Dr. Nuckols and myself are in agreement on the subject of a DNR.
There are probably going to be case by case differences of opinion or beliefs in the middle of family crises;
where one families circumstances especially financially differ from another’s.
But lingering questions become sudden or abrupt realities that have to be answered regardless;
sometimes immediately.
NATHANS CAMERA STORE
Nathan Services inc.com
NATHANS KODAK STORE
Create wonderful family memorabilia here
Kodak
_________________________________________________________________
===================================================================
What is the medical prognosis given by the attending physician(s)?
Has a ‘second opinion’ been sought?
Does this opinion confirm or call into question the original prognosis?
Is treatment being discontinued to hasten death? (hence ‘choosing death’)
or because the treatment itself has become burdensome with no realistic hope of recovery?
====================================================================
While care should never be futile, there are treatments that are futile, that is, useless.
Here it is important to press for clarity of definition,
as physicians may rightly speak of the futility of a medical procedure or treatment.
A treatment may be refused or discontinued if it is deemed futile,
but care is never futile and is not to cease until natural death.
We need to make a distinction between irretrievably dying and being terminally ill.
There are illnesses that may rightly be classified as terminal in that there is no cure and eventually the illness will lead to death.
For example, there are people who may live with terminal cancer for years.
Technically they may be said to suffer from a terminal illness,
but death is not imminent.
By contrast, there are others who are irretrievably,
dying, that is, the body itself has begun to shut down.
Barring divine intervention, the nearness to death is not measured by months or even weeks,
but days and hours.
====================================================================
What spiritual advice and guidance has been provided by the Pastor on the basis of the HOLY SCRIPTURES?
Given the ambiguities that leave us in uncertainty,
we make the best decisions we are able to make on the basis of GOD’s Word.
But finally, we trust even more strongly in the forgiveness of sins.
Purchased for us in Christ’s atoning death and guaranteed in HIS resurrection.
This applies to the loved one who is departed also.
We also must trust in HIS forgiveness after repentance for the wrong decisions
made out of ignorance or with minds darkened by sin.
There is no forgiveness of sins without true Repentance;
but true forgiveness of sins, requires the additional step of forgiving
ourselves for misdeeds in very sensitive family matters such as this also.
The Christian lives only by the promise that the blood of Jesus Christ
cleanses us from all sin or unrighteousness performed from misinformation;
lies or deceits of the enemy.
Once Christ has forgiven ; who are we to undue His forgiveness by not forgiving ourselves.
Refusing to forgive one-self can then become sin in and of itself.
Therefore let-go of the guilt and the pain and suffering, after true repentance is done.
Be forgiven and free in Christ Jesus.
Jesus said ,I came to set the captives free; don't stay captive inside yourself any longer.
The words that you didn’t get a chance to say to that departed loved one,
can be said to your Father which is in heaven.